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Here is an interesting article from Love Rugby League;
https://www.loverugbyleague.com/post/ed ... r-success/
They say that you have to go back to 2006 to find a SL winner that fielded less than 7 home grown players in their side. But Leeds Wigan and Saints are fairly wealthy clubs with a decent pool of youngsters playing in their locality and a tradition of winning. So I don't think there is a direct argument for saying you need at least 7 players to have a chance of winning the trophy, but it must surely be a major factor. And you can list possible reasons for recruiting 'from within';
Youngsters grow up playing the clubs style of rugby and can easily slot into the team.
Club loyalty is higher, particularly if they are 'home town' players.
Effort and determination to win is likely to be higher.
They are willing to sit in the squad filling in for injured 1st team players whilst gaining experience.
Cost to the club is less than an expensive overseas import and they get a dispensation from the salary cap.
More local players making the first team probably encourages more local school age players to play the game.
Unfortunately whilst we as a club have spent plenty of time and money on an academy, we have simply not produced sufficient SL standard players that we need. The most promising young players we have produced all seem to end up in lower leagues, with less than a handful in other SL clubs (3 ?). If we are to succeed then this needs to be turned around, and certainly in the years when we do produce a group of genuinely promising kids, we need to be playing them in the team or at another club rather than letting them fester on the sideline. |
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Here is an interesting article from Love Rugby League;
https://www.loverugbyleague.com/post/ed ... r-success/
They say that you have to go back to 2006 to find a SL winner that fielded less than 7 home grown players in their side. But Leeds Wigan and Saints are fairly wealthy clubs with a decent pool of youngsters playing in their locality and a tradition of winning. So I don't think there is a direct argument for saying you need at least 7 players to have a chance of winning the trophy, but it must surely be a major factor. And you can list possible reasons for recruiting 'from within';
Youngsters grow up playing the clubs style of rugby and can easily slot into the team.
Club loyalty is higher, particularly if they are 'home town' players.
Effort and determination to win is likely to be higher.
They are willing to sit in the squad filling in for injured 1st team players whilst gaining experience.
Cost to the club is less than an expensive overseas import and they get a dispensation from the salary cap.
More local players making the first team probably encourages more local school age players to play the game.
Unfortunately whilst we as a club have spent plenty of time and money on an academy, we have simply not produced sufficient SL standard players that we need. The most promising young players we have produced all seem to end up in lower leagues, with less than a handful in other SL clubs (3 ?). If we are to succeed then this needs to be turned around, and certainly in the years when we do produce a group of genuinely promising kids, we need to be playing them in the team or at another club rather than letting them fester on the sideline. | |
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Totally with "Offload". But how do we make Warrington a hot bed of rugby? How many kids play rugby in schools & amateur clubs? There is no doubt we have tried to develop our academy. But you have to look at how many players currently play in SuperLeague who are born in the Wire area and compare it with Wigan.
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I know there was a long thread about them previously, but there was an outstanding junior team at rylands that were virtually all signed up by saints. There is some excellent rugby talent in the town and we shouldn't be missing out on them to other clubs.
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If I was the parent of a teenager playing amateur rugby in the town, I'd think twice before allowing my child to sign for Warrington then sit at the back of the queue behind a bunch who trade on having played in the NRL in the distant past.
Also, plenty of families in the town have no association with Wires - they come from out of the town and have allegiances elsewhere so we have to sell the club to them.
We have to cast the net far and wide - in days of yore we signed the likes of Chris Rudd, Gary Chambers, Jon Roper, Sculthorpe, Harris and many others from amateur rugby outside of the town and even the county.
But we have to win them over. Sign for us and we'll nurture you, help you progress and improve and win trophies. At the moment I don't see that.
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| Quote morrisseyisawire="morrisseyisawire"If I was the parent of a teenager playing amateur rugby in the town, I'd think twice before allowing my child to sign for Warrington then sit at the back of the queue behind a bunch who trade on having played in the NRL in the distant past.
'"
In that case why have so many average players from our Academy, played 50 to 100 games in the first team with us?
Whereas the likes of Matty Russell, Samy Kibula, get cut by Wigan without even getting a chance? |
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| Quote sally cinnamon="sally cinnamon"In that case why have so many average players from our Academy, played 50 to 100 games in the first team with us?
Whereas the likes of Matty Russell, Samy Kibula, get cut by Wigan without even getting a chance?'"
Wigan had other youngsters that were better players than those you mentioned. |
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Exactly, but if you were a parent of a teenager playing amateur rugby in the town, what guarantee would you get if you let your kid sign for Wigan, that they wouldn't just be down the pecking order of Wigan youngsters awaiting a chance in the first team. In Warrington, the competition is likely to be easier and so is the route to getting a chance in the first team.
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If we are not turning out SL standard youngsters then either the coaching is the problem or the quality of youngster entering the academy is too low (or a combination of both).
I would say we are probably not attracting enough quality into our Academy. If you look at the senior players in the 2020 U19's then Dean Bedall, Aaron Pimblett and Ellis Longstaff were all recruited from Wigan's Scholarship group. Jacob Gannon came from Leeds, David Gibbons Huddersfield and Myles Tate from Castleford academies. That is not far from half the senior players. NB ironically I think Bedall is from the town and played for Crosfields.
If the system was working smoothly you would perhaps expect to see nearly all the U19's coming through from the U16's together perhaps with 1 or two starlets that we pinch from the likes of eg Castleford (Luis Johnson) or Huddersfield. If we get anyone from Saints or Wigan it tends to be because they have too much quality (in that position) to retain a given player.
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Just look at the Super League Dream Team and how many players from each club's Academy is to see how far behind our Academy is.
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I don't think we're miles behind academy wise. Wigan, saints and Leeds cast their net wide as well, not all these academy products are local to them. Our problem is them getting a chance and, as Sally alluded to earlier, us fans have to get on board with that by showing patience when they are blooded.
As a side issue (but IMO an important one) we missed a trick not giving Mike Cooper the captaincy upon his return. Local lad, leader, done it in the NRL and commands respect, always gives 100%, probably our best player and also a very articulate, intelligent bloke. Co-captaincy nonsense doesn't work, Hill i believe is a divisive figure and Hughes besides being walking mediocrity is a quiet fella.
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| Quote Moe syslak="Moe syslak"I know there was a long thread about them previously, but there was an outstanding junior team at rylands that were virtually all signed up by saints. There is some excellent rugby talent in the town and we shouldn't be missing out on them to other clubs.'"
Yeah i remember this, i thought it was odd that's saints saw so much in them but we didn't. Makes you question our scouts etc, Saints aren't the type of Club to simply sign anyone and hope they come good.
Now i'm not saying all these kids will become super league players, but at saints you see the chances the youngsters get.
Makes you wonder whether our kids just aren't up to scratch or it is Price blocking progression.
Somebody said the pressure on our coaches to win must be massive, and i believe this is a factor in not bringing the kids through.
But i also think not having an academy competition, with our young team playing each week is also a huge factor. It makes super league look so amateurish it's unreal and i find it bizzarre it was scrapped and many teams are against it i genuinely don't understand it. |
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| Quote Or thane="Or thane"Yeah i remember this, i thought it was odd that's saints saw so much in them but we didn't. Makes you question our scouts etc, Saints aren't the type of Club to simply sign anyone and hope they come good.
Now i'm not saying all these kids will become super league players, but at saints you see the chances the youngsters get.
Makes you wonder whether our kids just aren't up to scratch or it is Price blocking progression.
Somebody said the pressure on our coaches to win must be massive, and i believe this is a factor in not bringing the kids through.
But i also think not having an academy competition, with our young team playing each week is also a huge factor. It makes super league look so amateurish it's unreal and i find it bizzarre it was scrapped and many teams are against it i genuinely don't understand it.'"
With junior recruitment it's a case of if we sign enough of them, than there's more chance of some making SL. There's way more that don't make it from junior RL/academy than do as it's a numbers game. The trick is getting a better percentage that make it through into the SL ranks. |
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